U.S. stands by California bullet train project despite critics

[holasrmateo]

(12-18-2011 05:44 PM)TC Smith Wrote:  The purpose of HSR is to connect high-residency areas like SF and LA and leave the medium to short distance commuter/intercity traffic to those entities you mention. SF and LA are the target passengers, not every little town, medium city and/or planned stop in the San Joaquin valley. The land is not cheap, is relatively flat but again, there's already service through there that could easily and less-expensively be upgraded while the west side of the SJ valley is sparse, has less agriculture, and ius a straighter line from LA to SF by 87+ miles.
The Amtrak San Joaquin route should extend out of Bakersfield to meet the HSR line, should be grade-seperated and upgraded to continue service that already exists.
The current CAHSR plan is based on political support. That's why it goes through Palmdale, Mojave, Tehachapi, the middle of Bakersfield, through a bunch of places where ridership will be minimal at best, Fresno, before finally remembering where it's supposed to go.
Long-distance versus regional.


TCS - targets: productive farm lands, Bakersfield High School. Bad.

A train of any kind on the west side of the Central Valley paralleling the 5 would be the epitome of a train to nowhere. The largest settlement on that side of the valley is the overgrown truck stop known as Kettleman City. The 99 or an East side route would be able to link Bakersfield, Visalia, Fresno and eventually Merced, Modesto, Stockton and Sacramento, each with sizable populations, spread out to actually reach 100mph, in exchange for an extra 30 minutes if you are traveling by car. Even assuming you didn't have express routes with limited service, you have just as many stops just getting out of LA or SF at intercity speeds. There's a reason Amtrak runs on that side of the valley. If you want a train up and running, fastest, cheapest, which by the way is necessary to secure what federal money is still appropriated, the Central Valley is still the answer until a Phase II can be implemented.

[SP4449]

Hey Mikey could the leaders of HSR come out and say something like this "Dear residents and leaders of Palmdale, Mojave, Tehachapi we are sorry to say but the way you want our HSR route isn't sufficient enough to live up to its name because the route is not fast enough because it isn't straight enough that it needs to be and because of that we are going to reroute the ROW though the west end of the SJ Valley and this route is straighter and faster then the current routing." then go out of their way and educate people about the faster and straighter routing choice.

SP Costing the state and taxpayers a lot of $$$.

[TC Smith]

"A train of any kind on the west side of the Central Valley paralleling the 5 would be the epitome of a train to nowhere. "

Wrong, it's a "High-Speed" alignment to serve Major population centers.

" The largest settlement on that side of the valley is the overgrown truck stop known as Kettleman City. The 99 or an East side route would be able to link Bakersfield, Visalia, Fresno and eventually Merced, Modesto, Stockton and Sacramento, each with sizable populations..."

Again, those are already served by Amtrak on a route the should be double-tracked and as many smaller grade crossings as possible eliminated. This is NOT the market HSR is aiming for.

"Even assuming you didn't have express routes with limited service, you have just as many stops just getting out of LA or SF at intercity speeds. There's a reason Amtrak runs on that side of the valley."

Yes, you've managed to state my case.

"f you want a train up and running, fastest, cheapest, which by the way is necessary to secure what federal money is still appropriated, the Central Valley is still the answer until a Phase II can be implemented."

No, I want fast, well-planned, service that connects to all other services (Amtrak San Joaquin,Surfliner, Capitol - Metrolink - BART - ACE - CalTrain etc ..).
What we're going to get is a segment that goes from nowhere to nowhere, but they will probably be able to sell it to BNSF once all the money is gone.

And jonathan it was HSR that planned the route, not those cities which Don't want it in the first place (other than the politicians in Fresno and Lancaster).
Look at the cost of a roundtrip ticket and tell me who in any of those cities is gonna pay to ride HSR when Amtrak or driving is one/fifth the price.


TCS - it's not a commuter train.

[SP4449]

It will be extremely expensive and the cost could be just like an airline ticket. Its not going to be cheap at all.

SP Dear HSR scrap your current routing and change it and have it be the way Mikey once said how he would plan the route as he did on another thread.

[TC Smith]

Something as simple as looking at Google Earth over France will show you how straight the "real" high-speed lines are. Why the CAHSR folks who took their vacations.. ooops, "Business" trips over to see these obviously missed that part of the lesson.


TCS - jetBlue beats amtrak and driving on cost

[SP4449]

"And not to mention they are getting huge salaries."

SP Lets design our HSR line without any curves so that its as straight as a line.

[TC Smith]

(12-18-2011 11:57 PM)SP4449 Wrote:  SP Lets design our HSR line without any curves so that its as straight as a line.

Now you're just being dumb, besides, not all lines are straight.


TCS - or segments.